DNB EQUIVALENCE

Discussion in 'DNB CET board - DipNB' started by DR. UMA KULKARNI, Mar 8, 2006.

  1. SIR

    THIS PROBLEM EXISTS IN MANY MEDICAL COLLEGES
    DNB CANDIDATES ARE NOT CONSIDERED EQUIVALENT TO MS/MD CANDIDATES IN TERMS OF SENIORITY AND SALARY
    MANAGEMENT REQUIRES THE LATEST CIRCULAR FROM THE NBE STATING THAT BOTH ARE EQUIVALENT. WE IN LARGE NUMBERS ARE SUFFERING TORTURE DUE TO THIS. HOW SHOULD WE PROCEDE TO CONVINCE THE MANAGEMENT REGARDING THE SAME
    KINDLY DO THE NEEDFUL
  2. UMA,

    THIS PROBLEM HAD OCCURED ON 2 OCCASIONS IN MUMBAI, OF WHICH, ONE WAS IN MY HOSPITAL(NAIR) ITSELF.

    1.DNB WAS CONSIDERED AS EQUIVALENT TO M.D/M.S, AS FAR AS FURTHER STUDIES LIKE D.M/M.CH WERE CONCERNED, AT THE TIME OF THE SUPERSPECIALITY ENTRANCE EXAM.

    2.DNB WAS ALSO CONSIDERED FOR ELIGIBILITY OF THE DOCTOR, FOR THE POST OF LECTURER, FURTHER PROMOTION, ETC, EVEN INCLUDING HOD'S POST!
    3.MOST WELLKNOWN INSTITUTIONS LIKE NIMHANS ETC, CONSIDER DNB OR M.D/M.S AS EQUIVALENT FOR FILLING UP THEIR POSTS OF RESIDENTS IN SUPERSPECIALITY AS WELL AS FOR JOBS.

    I WILL SUGGEST THAT YOU CHECK THIS POINT ON THE DNB WEBSITE
    www.natboard.nic.in
    YOU CAN EVEN CONTACT THEM BY E-MAIL IF YOU WANT TO GET AN ANSWER ABOUT THIS PROBLEM, BUT THE BEST THING WILL BE TO GET A WRITTEN REPLY FROM THEM, BY APPROACHING THEM THROUGH YOUR DEAN.

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  3. thank you very much Dr. Asha for the reply

    we have tried that but still having some problems in convincing the management

    we will try again to write to the board and to the MCI

    we have submitted the DNB equivalence letter by the NBE

    that did not work

    what management wants is a letter by the MCI which says that DNB is equivalent to MS/MD

    is it available on the net?

    thanks for answering and thanks for your concern

    god bless

    uma
  4. EXCERPT FROM DNB WEBSITE -BULLETIN OF INFORMATION

    Introduction
    The National Board of Examination was established in 1975 with the prime objective of improving the quality of the Medical Education by elevating the level and establishing standards of post graduate examinations in modern medicine on an all India basis. There are more than 149 recognized Medical Colleges in the country. In addition there are 370 accredited institutions imparting training in various Broad and Super specialities for the award of postgraduate qualification in Broad and super specialities. The Board at present conducts postgraduate and postdoctoral examinations in 54 disciplines approved by the Board for the award of Diplomate of National Board. The Medical Council of India has laid down standards for post graduate examinations conducted by various medical colleges and affiliated to concerned universities and other institutions, yet the levels of proficiency and standards of evaluation vary considerably in these institutions. The setting up of a National Body to conduct post graduate medical examination was intended to provide a common standard and mechanism of evaluation of minimum level of attainment of the objective for which post graduate courses were started in medical institutions. Moreover, intra country and international comparison is facilitated with the availability of commonly accepted evaluation mechanism.

    Recognition of DNB qualifications

    The Nomenclature of the degree awarded by the National Board of Examinations is called the “Diplomate of National Board”. The list of recognised qualifications awarded by the Board in various Broad and Super specialities as approved by the Government of India and included in the First Schedule of IMC Act 1956 is as at Annexure III.

    The Diplomate qualifications awarded by the National Board of Examinations have been equated with the postgraduate and post doctorate degrees awarded by other Indian Universities by the Government of India, Ministry of Health and Family Welfare; vide their notifications issued from time to time. The holders of Board’s qualification awarded after an examination are eligible to be considered for specialists post in any Hospital other than a training/teaching institution. For teaching appointments as lecturers in the Broad specialities, the holders of Diplomate of National Board should have at least One year experience as Tutor/Registrar/Demonstrator or an equivalent post in recognised medical college imparting undergraduate teaching. Regarding the candidates holding Diplomate NB in Super Speciality Subjects, the training shall be for two years in a recognised medical college having recognised post graduate medical degree in the concerned speciality for appointments as a Lecturer.

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  5. DNB Equivalence. MCI norms-clarification required.

    Its a sad state of affairs in this Great Country of ours that a degree awarded by a board as high as the National Board of Examinations is not considered to be equivalent to post graduate qualifications awarded by other universities in the same country such as MD/MS. The NBE is conducting examinations free from bias and malpractice and this being under the Ministry of health and family welfare itself is believed to be an examination of one of the highest order. The MCI stil insists that DNB graduates may be considered equivalent to MD/MS after one year research experience. I wish to know how many MD/MS have this kind of research experience and how are we different from them. We too submit a dissertation like them and we are permitted to appear for exams only after the dissertation/thesis is accepted by the board. We take an examination at the National level unlike the MD/MS which is only a University level exam. While the ministry continues to maintain its stand that the DNB qualification is equivalent to the MD/MS of any other university in this country, the MCI states that one year post DNB research experience is required for consideration to teaching appointments in medical colleges despite the fact that many of us undergo the DNB training after being appointed to medical colleges on paid teaching posts like tutor/demonstrator/senior residents after completion of diplomas in the speciality concerned. And even after we furnish the desired Research experience of one year, the managements of these private institutions do not promote us / equate us with MD/MS for the fear of not getting the MCI recognition. I hope some one will throw light on this matter. And I fervently pray our Honourable minister of Health and family welfare who so vehemently stated that the DNB qualification awarded by the NBE is one of the degrees of the highest order in this country at the 2005 NBE convocation ceremony at Hyderabad and promised to do justice to DNB graduates on this matter of equivalence reads this message and offers some justice to us.
  6. HELLO,

    IN BOMBAY MUNICIPAL CORPORATION, THE POST OF LECTURER REQUIRE THE CANDIDATE TO HAVE 3 YEARS OF TEACHING EXPERIENCE, FOR WHICH ONLY 1 YEAR(LAST YEAR) OF THE RESIDENCY SYSTEM EXPERIENCE IS COUNTED.

    DUE TO HEALTH CARE REQUIREMENTS, CANDIDATES WHO HAVE PASSED THEIR M.D/M.S ARE APPOINTED AS LECTURERS ON AD-HOC BASIS, BUT EVEN THIS EXPERIENCE IS NOT COUNTED, WHEN THE INTERVIEWS ARE HELD FOR THE REGULAR POSTS OF LECTURERS!

    SO THIS HAS ACTUALLY BECOME A VICIOUS CYCLE, BECAUSE IF THERE'S NO EXPERIENCE, THERE'S NO POST & IF THERE'S NO POST, WHERE'S THE EXPERIENCE?

    SO I REALLY DON'T THINK THAT CANDIDATES WHO HAVE PASSED M.D/M.S ARE BETTER OFF IN ANY WAY THAN DNB PASSED CANDIDATES!

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  7. It is not the teaching experience that is being taken into account.

    A DNB with any number of years of teaching experience is not treated on par with even a fresh MD/MS either with regards to designation or salary.

    The reason being stated is that this qualification is not approved by MCI. Why then should a course like DNB be there itself in this country...? The NBE is under the Ministry of health and family welfare and if the qualification offered by a Government body is not acceptable to another governmental body i.e MCI...why should there be a course like this and why the degree rated highly ....Are these ratings only to make the government feel good about the exam conducted and degree given? What about the people who actually slog for 3 full years to acquire this qualification? Is the MCI going to approve of this qualification or not? Is the govt going to do something regarding this matter of equivalence?
    If not , I gues its high time we stop recommending this degree to peers and juniors who wish to acquire a PG qualification.
  8. DNB

    VIJAYALAKSHMI,

    MCI HAS ALREADY RECOGNISED DNB QUALIFICATIONS OBTAINED AFTER 1982, AS PER EXTENSION OF THE IMC 1956 ACT. THE DNB BOARD WAS IN FACT STARTED WITH THE IDEA OF HAVING A UNIFORM NATIONAL LEVEL COURSE & EXAM THEREOF.THESE QUALIFICATIONS ARE EQUIVALENT TO THE M.D/M.S/D.M/M.CH QUALIFICATIONS WHICH ARE RECOGNISED BY MCI.

    NOW IT HAS ALSO RE-ALLOWED MAJOR TEACHING HOSPITALS, WHICH ARE CONDUCTING M.D/M.S/D.M/M.CH COURSES, TO CONDUCT DNB COURSES IN THESE SUBJECTS AS WELL, PROVIDED THAT THE STUDENT TEACHER RATIO OF 1:1 IS MAINTAINED & THAT THERE ARE SUFFICIENT FACILTIES IN THAT INSTITUTION TO CONDUCT THE DNB COURSE.THERE'S A LETTER FROM THE MCI STATING THIS FACT.

    SEE THE DNB WEBSITE FOR THESE DETAILS:
    www.natboard.nic.in

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I recently lost (releaved by the college) my post of assosiate professor as MCI did not want any DNB people in the teaching posts. Another professor was also removed from the job in Vydehi medical college at Bangalore. Dr Vickram Shetty from Mangalore is preparing for a case against MCI and I am also going in same line. For information contact Dr Shetty 9448361244 and join DNB assosiation. No point in crying.
    Dr Sudhir hebbar
  10. shivaprasad

    shivaprasad Guest

    DNB recognition controversy

    Hello,
    Recently MCI is creating problems about the recognition of DNB degree holders. Even after passing the toughest exam , we are suffering with descrimination done by this MCI . PREVIOUSLY THERE WAS NO PROBLEM ABOUT RECOGNITION OF DNB DEGREES. noiw all of a sudden MCI cannot derecognise DNB degrees .if it wants derecognise DNB degrees it can be done prospectively but not retrospectively.this simple point MCI IS forgotten.
    MCI is giving instructions to college management people to remove DNB degree holders from the post of asst prof ,assoc prof , prof .And college management people are afraid of MCI AND THEY cannot support us.it has happened in many colleges of karnataka.
    HENCE i request all DNB degree holders riase the voice against it.try to fight legally
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Well, You guys may not agree with me.
    But tell me one reson why DNB should be considered at Par with MD/MS.
    All the doctors after graduation slog to get an MD/MS/Diploma and not DNB. Those who FAIL in the entrance exams turn to DNB and other similar degrees (like CPS and FCPS in Maharashtra). So, When you guys know that you failed in those exams which could fetch you MD/MS/Diploma and those who were much superior or better than you guys got MD/MS/Diploma, then how can you even think of considering yourself equivalent to MD/MS/Diploma holders. They are much superior to you. Forget MD/MS, even diploma candidates are much superior to you guys.
  12. DNB COURSES

    HI,

    I DON'T AT ALL AGREE WITH YOU THAT DNB IS INFERIOR TO MD/MS!IN FACT, IT IS A MUCH TOUGHER EXAM THAN MD/MS IN THAT RESPECTIVE BRANCH!SO IF THE HEALTH MINISTRY HAS ALREADY GIVEN ITS PERMISSION, TO CONSIDER IT AS EQUIVALENT TO MD/MS IN THAT BRANCH, I REALLY FAIL TO UNDERSTAND AS TO WHY ANYONE SHOULD OBJECT TO THAT POLICY!

    YOU ARE PERHAPS IGNORANT, ABOUT THE WAY MANY MD/MS COURSES ARE CONDUCTED, IN SOME PARTS OF INDIA! I'VE HEARD FROM VARIOUS RELIABLE SOURCES, THAT INSTEAD OF DOING THE WORK OF A RESIDENT, THESE DOCTORS ARE MADE TO RUN ERRANDS AT THE RESIDENCE OF THE BOSS!

    ANOTHER THING, WHICH IS QUITE A BIG SHAME TO OUR COUNTRY IN GENERAL & TO THE MEDICAL/TECHNICAL FRATERNITY IN PARTICULAR, IS THE WAY THE PAPERS LEAK OUT AT VARIOUS COMPETITIVE TESTS, INCLUDING ALL INDIA ENTRANCE EXAMS, THANKS TO OUR IMPROVED TECHNOLOGICAL METHODS, LIKE PEN-SCANNER ETC! YOU MUST HAVE HEARD OF IT LAST YEAR, WHERE AT A PARTICULAR CENTRE, THE QUESTIONS WERE SCANNED BY SUPERVISORS, SENT BY SMS TO A GROUP OF EXAMINERS WITHIN A RANGE OF 50 KMS, WHO IN TURN, SOLVED THEM & SENT BACK THE ANSWERS TO THESE MCQS, WHICH WERE CONVEYED BACK TO CERTAIN(!) STUDENTS BY SMS!

    IN THE PROCESS, MANY DESERVING CANDIDATES ARE UNABLE TO GET THE COURSE OF THEIR CHOICE! BESIDES, I'VE ALSO HEARD FROM RELIABLE SOURCES, THAT THERE'S A HIGH LEVEL RACKET AT SOME OF THESE EXAMS, WHEREIN THE COMPUTER IS USED, TO EXCHANGE MARKS, BETWEEN TWO CONSECUTIVE CANDIDATES!LEAVE ALONE THAT, SOME GREAT CANDIDATES ARE EVEN GIVEN THE SPECIAL(!) BENEFIT OF APPEARING FOR EXAM IN BASEMENT, WITH SUPERVISORS EVEN DICTATING THE ANSWERS TO THEM!

    THE POINT THAT I'M TRYING TO MAKE IS THAT THERE ARE BLACK SHEEP EVERYWHERE, SO ITS NOT AS IF ALL DNB CANDIDATES ARE ALWAYS EXCELLENT, OR THAT ALL MD/MS CANDIDATES ARE ALWAYS BAD, OR VICE VERSA! EACH SYSTEM CERTAINLY HAS ITS OWN ADVANTAGES & DISADVANTAGES, SO ULTIMATELY IT IS UPTO THE STUDENT, TO PROGRESS IN HIS/HER KNOWLEDGE & IN CAREER!NOWADAYS, THERE ARE SO MANY OTHER COURSES, APART FROM MEDICAL & ENGINEERING, SO WHY NOT TRY FOR THOSE AS CAREER?

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  13. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Hi
    At present the issue is not if DNB is equal to MD or not. The issue is that MCI is breaking its one rules without bringing new official rules. The idosyncretic behavior of MCI is causing major problems. That needs to be fixed in the court of law which will happon very soon.
    Dr Sudhir hebbar
  14. udy

    udy Guest

    DNB Equivalence.

    I find it strange even on the part of DNB authorities to turn a blind eye in the matter of DNB equivalence.I recently was not considered for the post of a lecturer in ortho cos I was a dnb pass candidate and not a MS.

    There is no point fighting with the local /respective medical authorities cos they are nothing but slaves of MCI.They have to obey MCI.

    I have a serious grudge on the DNB authorities.
    All they do is repeatedly point to the GR of DNB equivalence ,which is in practice shown the waste paper box by the MCI.
    Its a frustrating exp for anyone who has undergone such humiliation and discrimination after being at par or most of the times better than the MD/MS candidates.(Nothing personal with the MS/MD guys.This is a fact.Ive even passed a diploma,so I know the state of affairs).

    Inspite of repeated mai;s to the DNB authorities,they havent replied me anything.

    The problem I feel should be addressed by a massive effort by the DNB passouts as well as those who are pursuing it.
    We all should form a body/include the NBE and collectively fight the MCI autocracy. Thing is what one grp does in one part of the country(file court case etc), the rest do not know.
    We lack our union. So please we all shd form a proper body and then fight MCI.
    Opinions are welcome.
    Udy
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    In future India only the people of reserved category that too with poltical and money muscles can get MD/MS Degrees. The candidates with DNB are far more superior to those MD/MS who got admitted through reservation scoring a very meagre percentile. The DNB is dared by those who have merit and not by those who have failed to get MD/MS but deprived by the right because of very low merited people entering the course through reservations. If you have the merit why you people cry for reservation! Let the admissions happen through pure and fair merit basis,let us see,who is worried. People who got MD/MS seem to be worried about DNB because of the employment opportunities,obviously in any way DNB's outperform the MD/MS obtained through back door means!
  16. to those holding MS/MD

    HI DOCS DONT think that PEOPLE OPTING for DNB r those who did'nt excel in their PG entrance.reasons

    1.they r gutsy because they believe in their ability & perfomence to take up such HIMALAYAN TASK, when others never dream even.

    2.my frinds as you -who scared to mention ur own name quoted DNBs r those who did'nt get in reg PG entrance:- WE WANT THE DEGREE WE LOVE B'CAUSE WE FELL IN LOVE WITH THE SPECIALITY WE DREAM NOT THE ONE THE ENTRANCE OFFERS-Hey its for u my kitten.( i quit everything for my ORTHOPEDICS my frind= so learn from the master dont let ur tounge speak,let ur brain work.)

    3.if MS/MD docs think it is superior,THEN why should they struggle to get DNB?

    4.RESERVATIONS UPTO GRAVEYARDS IS ANOTHER FACTOR MY FRIEND.

    5.There r a lot of private med col in this country rec by THE GREAT MCI, WHERE NO OF FACULTY AND PG STUDENTS R MORE THAN PATIENTS,DO U THINK THEY GET BETTER EXPOSURE THAN DNB TO QUALIFY PG DEGREE ?

    6.I believe that all those who qualify in their PG have got some BONES TO STAND , SOME MUSCLES TO STABILIZE and lot BRAINS TO TAKE CARE OF OUR OWN HUMAN COMMUNITY; SO DONT EXPRESS STUPID IDEAS MY FRIEND

    I BEG YOUR PARDON IF I'VE PAINED ANY ONE WITH THIS VIEW.


    DONT SEE ANY ONE AS MEAN: THE MEAN TODAY MAY B UR MASTER TOMORROW, AFTERALL WE R HUMANBEINGS WITH DEFFERENT COLORS AND IDEAS.

    EVEN IF U CANT HELP DONT SCREW UP THE OTHERS HAPPINESS

    Thank u

    SUDHAKAR



    THANK U.
  17. dr.k. prasad

    dr.k. prasad Guest

    Full Judgment Text equating DNB with MD/MS

    Please, display the full judgment text equating DNB with MD/MS.
    THANK U
  18. DNB COURSES

    DR.PRASAD,

    THEY ARE GIVEN ON DNB WEBSITE, UNDER DNB INFORMATION BULLETIN.

    CHECK THE DNB WEBSITE FOR DETAILS:-
    www.natboard.nic.in

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  19. my reply is to the guy who has posted this message--
    "Well, You guys may not agree with me.
    But tell me one reson why DNB should be considered at Par with MD/MS.
    All the doctors after graduation slog to get an MD/MS/Diploma and not DNB. Those who FAIL in the entrance exams turn to DNB and other similar degrees (like CPS and FCPS in Maharashtra). So, When you guys know that you failed in those exams which could fetch you MD/MS/Diploma and those who were much superior or better than you guys got MD/MS/Diploma, then how can you even think of considering yourself equivalent to MD/MS/Diploma holders. They are much superior to you. Forget MD/MS, even diploma candidates are much superior to you guys."
    1. the message reflects this guy is a pschycho and is a failure in life because he is rigid ,his believes are global .
    2. he thinks that students who fail go to dnb ,let me make him clear i cleared all india pre pg exam ,i dint get my desired field ,thats why i am doing snb and i am proud of it .
    3. he doesnt know the difference between a doploma and a diplomate
    poor guy .i pitty him and his cappabilities in postgraduation if at all he has
  20. dr.k. prasad

    dr.k. prasad Guest

    DNB vs MCI

    The present scenario regarding DNB Teachers, created by MCI is unWarranted whatever may be the reasons behind it. National Board of Examinations has so far done a good job in creating a significant pool of Medical PG talent which is very much needed for Teacher starving Medical Colleges. But the Board has miserably failed to get equal status to its Degree holders on par with University MD/MS, which are Under the Iron fist of its cousin MCI. It seems, traditional war is going on between the two governamental organizations, making the poor DNB holders, the scape goats.
    It is high time MCI correct its contemptous attitude towards National Board and concentrate on its holy task of maintaing high ethical and professional standards of medical education & elimination of rabid corruption in its rank and file. Of late, it is engaged more in petty street politics. NBE has not only done its job of maintaing uniform PG standards, it created a Large Pool of higher medical education centres making Higher medical education flexible, feasible, economical & cost effective and affordable to all sections of public (there is a lesson for HRD Ministry in this to learn)which is more
    relevant to our society, thus espousing the social cause. Whereas MCI has miserably failed in all, it just created white elephants, higher education is made costliest, faciliatated corruption and failed to get uniformity in its MD/MS/Diploma courses.
    It will do more good if both the sister organizations co-ordinate & co-operate, after all both of them are manned by Doctors, not by petty politicians. Please, both of U raise to the occasion and do not spoil the careers of Ur own colleagues.
    Are U listening?
  21. DNB COURSES

    DR.PRASAD,

    I FULLY ENDORSE YOUR VIEWS, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE OUR COUNTRY NEEDS GOOD DOCTORS.

    I'VE KNOWN MANY DNB-PASSED PEOPLE WHO ARE DOING VERY WELL IN ACADEMICS, ETC!

    IN FACT, I SENT E-MAILS TO THE DNB BOARD, AS WELL AS THE MCI & AS EXPECTED, THERE'S NO REPLY FROM EITHER OF THEM SO FAR!

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  22. dr.k. prasad

    dr.k. prasad Guest

    I think it is high time Post Graduate Medical education in the Country be handed over to NBE and relieve MCI of that much burden so that it can concentrate on Undergraduate Medical education and discipline of Medical Practitioners.
    That way the controversy:MD/MS vs DNB suffers natural death, paving way for quality PG medical education of uniform standard throughout the country.
    The proof for the argument: eagerness of more & more MD/MS/Diploma candidates competing for DNB.
    Is that the reason, MCI is worried?
  23. DNB COURSES

    DR.PRASAD,

    I FEEL THAT IF BOTH THE ORGANIZATIONS, VIZ. MCI + DNB, JOIN HANDS & ARRANGE TO HAVE A RESIDENCY PROGRAM IN WHICH THE CANDIDATE GETS AN ADVANTAGE OF WORKING IN PUBLIC SECTOR & PRIVATE SECTOR, IT WILL BE THE MOST IDEAL, SINCE EACH OF THEM HAVE THEIR OWN BENEFITS!

    IF THAT IS DIFFICULT TO COORDINATE, AT LEAST BOTH THE SECTORS SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO ENROLL MD/MS AS WELL AS DNB STUDENTS!
    OUR COUNTRY SURELY NEEDS MORE QUALIFIED DOCTORS.

    ON ONE HAND, THE HEALTH MINISTRY WANTS TO COMPULSORILY MAKE EVERY DOCTOR WORK IN RURAL AREAS, SO IF IT SORTS OUT THIS TUSSLE BETWEEN MCI & DNB, IT WILL BE GOOD FOR INDIA, AS MANY MORE MEDICOS WILL GET PG-QUALIFIED WITHIN INDIA ITSELF & WILL HOPEFULLY AVOID GOING ABROAD FOR HIGHER STUDIES!

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  24. Helper

    Helper Guest

    my reply is for EDITED SBJH chennai
    if he is so confident about his md/ms/diploma, i urge him to just "APPEAR" once for dnb part 2 and let him see for himself where he stands........
    and as far as the quality of md is concerned......i know how it is since i have done a diploma from a very very reputed institute (ranked number 4 in the all india govt. hospitals according to some official websites) and let me tell you.......dnb's standard is much more better......
    and as far as his pride is giving the "great" entrance exams in concerned....let me tell you i had given the exam twice,........was getting ms surgery the first time.....not interested....left it.......appeared again and joined the diploma.....and i am fully aware of the so called "transparancies" of the great entrance tests........they probably are the most corrupted exams on this planet.........worse than the exam they would probably take for jail inmates in a village in bihar.....
    and as far as MCI goes, my friend, Dr. ***** ***** is EDITED we have in our country.....he was sent to jail and brought back again because of his "contacts.".....he was found to take bribes worth crores of rupees to give his very valued "accredition" to the great private medical colleges which already are making a profit of around 40-50 crores annually due to the various management/nri, etc.....seats........mci is the biggest scandal we have in our country after tehalka......and its alive and kicking
  25. Please look in dnbalumni.org website

    In Mangalore DNB doctors have formed an association and soon will be filing a case against MCI. Please look into their website and join
    Dr Sudhir hebbar
  26. Look in dnbalumni.org

    Join dnbalumni.org
  27. Dr.Gopi

    Dr.Gopi Guest

    DNB ALUMNI ASSOCIATION

    Dear Friends

    From what I gathered, I deduce that MCI is the Greatest Scandal in the Medical Field of our Country (The Delhi High Court commented on MCI, 'Den of Corruption") and it is not easy to take on this Mafia headed by MCI's very own Harshad Mehta, Dr.KD and his Netas & Babus & Private College Lobby.

    I strongly suggest that All the DNB qualified doctors must join together & form an Alumni Association with a Strong Leadership and become a Mighty Force both Financially & Numerically, to take on, not only MCI but also any other Agency that doesn't honour our Credentials and hinder our Progress.

    I also gather that there are more than 8000+ DNB holders in the country, many of whom are successful, in Private & Public Teaching Institutes & in Practice, & if they compulsorily join & contribute to Alumni Association, it will be a Formidable Force to reckon with.
    Please, Wake up and act Fast.
  28. Dr.K.Prasad

    Dr.K.Prasad Guest

    DNB ALUMNI ASSOCIATION

    Hello!
    I have come across one such association, perhaps only one in the country.
    www.dnbalumni.org
    e-mail: docvickys@gmail.com
    The association is formed by enterprising DNB doctors of Mangalore, Karnataka and they are shortly filing an appeal in High court. I believe there are nearly 170 members enrolled. I suggest entire DNB community can join this Alumni Association and participate.
  29. DNB COURSES

    DR.GOPI,

    I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU'RE SUGGESTING FORMATION OF A WELFARE ASSOCIATION OF ALL MEDICOS WHO HAVE PASSED THEIR DNB EXAMS IN BROAD SPECIALITY &/OR IN SUPERSPECIALITY.

    THE IDEA IS CERTAINLY VERY GOOD, BUT UNLESS & UNTIL IT HAS GOT A STRONG BACKING FROM THE HEALTH MINISTRY, UNDER WHOSE VERY JURISDICTION, THE DNB BOARD COMES, DOCTORS ALONE MAY NOT BE ABLE TO DO MUCH ABOUT THESE MATTERS, I'M AFRAID!

    THE MCI'S BIGGEST TRUMP CARD IS IT'S POWER TO RECOGNIZE THE DEGREES OF MEDICAL COLLEGES ALLOVER INDIA, AS WELL AS OF SOME FOREIGN COUNTRIES, STARTING FROM THE BASIC M.B.B.S DEGREE !SO NOONE WILL DARE TO OPPOSE IT OUTRIGHT, AS YOU'RE SUGGESTING!

    THE ONLY HOPE FOR US IS TO ELECT RIGHT-THINKING MEMBERS, BOTH IN STATE MEDICAL COUNCILS AS WELL AS IN THE MEDICAL COUNCIL OF INDIA, AS & WHEN THEIR ELECTIONS ARE HELD!

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  30. Guest

    Guest Guest

    i have done Dnb in pathology and am facing a similar discrimination at the hands of the MCI they (MCI) does not consider us (DNB_) candidates at par with MD/MS despite the fact that we have gone through a superior examinations than to those MD/MS kind of examinations i think all the national board students at various posts should come together and put up a case against the MCI at the supreme court for once and for all times a decision will be arrived at, which will upheld our right and self esteem as discrimination on basis of degrees at such a noble professional front is very disheartening ,considering the fact that tghe DNB people as far afar more superior the kind of examination they have to face too.
  31. DNB doc

    DNB doc Guest

    reg the So called "MD"

    My dear MD friend,

    there are few points i need to remind you about

    Three easiest way to get MD degree:

    1. Be born to a rich DAD so that he can pay your capitation.

    2. Lic ! your boss a..s !!............do his peon job

    3. Fail three times in your final MD and your boss will Kick your a..s out off the course (MD) as he is frustated seeing your face in the MD exam. I guess this is the easiest. 8)

    I am sure these three things do not work for getting a DNB
  32. DNB doc

    DNB doc Guest

    In respinse to Dr K Prasad

    Its not only, More and more MDs opting for DNB ( including me !)

    Other reason is the foreign medical councils like GMC has started recognising DNB and not MD. Kuwait pays more to a DNB more than MD ( I guess it does not empoy MDs) .................after all i am proud of my DNB than my MD.

    :D
  33. suni

    suni Guest

    DNB approval

    what are the countries which accepted DNB
  34. People who are so much Anti DNB should face the exams once or twice and proove that they can pass. And i fervently pray that they should get royally rammed in the OSCE by examiners who are nearly a dozen in number. Let them first appear for the exams before making their comments. People who make such nasty comments must have got their seats at the behest of their parents money or some form of manipulation (large scale corruption in this vcountry) or the reservation policy. So things have happened to them easy and their tongues simply wag freely making loose comments.
  35. Dr. K Kumar

    Dr. K Kumar Guest

    Hello,
    As someone who has passed MD from on of the top medical colleges in India, and then appeared and passed DNB I can tell those who have disdain for DNB that it is a much fairer and very much tougher exam to pass. If you have been a regular student, you will pass an MD exam until you really mess up, but that is not the case with DNB.
    I have also subsequently passed MRCP in the UK, which I found very similar to DNB (the concept of appearing at a centre wher you have no "mai-baap"). Most countries in the world have a system of a national board (for example american board of cardiology or internal medicine in the US, royal college of physicians in the UK) which have a standard exam for all candidates.
    We in India are quite fossilized in our approach to medicine (like pretty much everything else that is handled by babus). This archaic mentality is still prevelant as seen by some of the posts by "guests".
  36. ami_shams

    ami_shams Guest

    guys must have read wht Dr AMBUMANI R has to say abt PG education in India.MD is not recognised everywhere abroad where as DNB candidates given more preference.Very shortly, MCI won't have much work as far as PG Education is concerned.One Autonomus body will look after all PG courses,may be DNBBoard with a new name.More and more Hospitals are going to offer DNB courses,means more no of DNB PGs per year
  37. MD doc

    MD doc Guest

    just one question

    Isten u all DNB jokers--> there was a scam in DNB board where people paid money to pass thier part 2 --> this was 5 years back..
    Secondly we know the quality of teaching which is done for DNB --> u all r just treated as RMOs in hospitals where u work--i know orthopedic DNB students working in medical wards to make up for shortage--> so much for DNB .Secondly considering DNB is so good why dont all people start leaving MD seats and start joining DNB
    Thirdly with a MD u can always have a DNB its another feather in ur cap but with a DNB never a MD--> so guess where do u all stand
  38. MD doc

    MD doc Guest

    DNB is a joke

    wats the big deal about OSCEs --infact at the observed stations its like a maths exams u can score and score and score whereas u cant do that do that for case presentation--out of the 20 osces each of 5 marks u can easily score 70-80 and even pass if u royally F*CK up ur long case.
    This is what happened--i failed MD pediatrics but i clerared DNB
  39. Guest

    Guest Guest

    cps info

    can anyone plz tell me the website or link for CPS broucher,,, i m really dumb to knoow nothing about it,,, plz help me out becoz i dont hv any options left
  40. CPS COURSES

    HELLO,

    UNFORTUNATELY, THEIR WEBSITE IS NOT OPENING CORRECTLY FOR A LONG TIME, SO PLEASE CONTACT THEM DIRECTLY OR TELEPHONICALLY, OR SEND A LETTER BY POST, ASKING FOR THEIR BROCHURE IF THEY HAVE IT AT PRESENT.

    PLEASE CHECK ABOUT THEIR MCI-RECOGNITION STATUS FOR THEIR DIPLOMAS & DEGREES.AT LEAST THEY SHOULD BE RECOGNIZED BY MAHARASHTRA MEDICAL COUNCIL/MUHS UNIVERSITY, SO THAT YOU CAN PRACTICE IN MAHARASHTRA & PERHAPS EVEN DNB BOARD MAY CONSIDER THEIR DIPLOMA AS VALID IN THAT CASE.

    COLLEGE OF PHYSICIANS & SURGEONS OF BOMBAY,
    DR.E.E.BORGES MARG,
    PAREL, MUMBAI-400012.
    TEL:24137915.

    THEIR OFFICE IS IN THE SAME BUILDING AS THEIR LECTURE HALLS & IT IS LOCATED VERY NEAR KEM HOSPITAL, MUMBAI.

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  41. MD Doc

    MD Doc Guest

    Can u get a MD after DNB

    TO ALL DNB JOKERS
    CAN U GET A MD AFTER U GET DNB --NO
    BUT AFTER MD U CAN ALWAYS GET DNB ---THOSE WHO GO FOR DNB ARE LOSERS/SUBSTANDARD STUDENTS WHO HAVENT GOT MD IN ENTRANCE EXAMS......NO WONDER U ALL HAVE BEEN KICKED OUT OF MEDICAL COLLEGES AS U ALL R SUBSTANDARD STUFF
  42. parvas24

    parvas24 Guest

    there is no doubt that MD degree done from reputed institutes is held in high regard ..... but of late MD degrees have become a booming business for Private medical colleges and Universities all over the country ... the situation is getting worse each year... so many people are alose getting MD degrees withouit any merit based on donations !!!!

    with the question of DNB degrees .... everybody knows that the majority of the Private institutes admitting the CET passed candidates have no formal PG training or lectures conducted by those private hospitals ... so many have to do self study and try to acquire the skills which can be difficult when these private hospitals make them work like RMO's for cheap labour!!! many doing DNB suffer greatly due to this .... ultimately this shows at the Final DNB exam as they are weeded out by the DNB examiners .... it is a pity ....

    DNB degree is no doubt very good ... it is a Parallel degree to the MD/ MS ...... but the National Board does not conduct any lectures to improve the DNB education quality ... so many good candidates are left to find their own lectures and guidance ....
    those who did Diplomas from medical colleges and Universities would find
    DNB suitable as they can improve on their previous experience as they attended the lectures and academics during their diploma ... this would better prepare them for the DNB final exams ....

    ALTHOUGH the Ministry of Health mentions equal status of DNB to MD/MS degrees .... they are parallel courses ..... it would be like comparing Apples to Oranges !!!!

    If the Medical council of India lifts the ban on the DNB courses in Medical colleges and Universities where MD/ MS courses are conducted then there could be a change in the way people look at DNB degrees ....
  43. HELLO PARVAS24,

    I FULLY AGREE WITH YOUR POINT THAT MCI SHOULD ALLOW PUBLIC TEACHING HOSPITALS TO CONDUCT DNB COURSES IN ADDITION TO MD/MS, IF THE 1:1 RATIO BETWEEN TEACHER:STUDENT IS MAINTAINED & ADEQUATE INFRASTRUCTURE & OTHER FACILITIES ARE AVAILABLE!

    ON THE WHOLE, IT IS INDEED A VERY SAD THING TO SEE THAT DAY BY DAY, EDUCATION AT ANY LEVEL IS BECOMING QUITE COMMERCIALIZED!THIS ATTITUDE CERTAINLY PUTS THE INTELLIGENT BUT ECONOMICALLY BACKWARD STUDENTS AT A GREAT DISADVANTAGE, AS NEITHER CAN THEY AFFORD PROFESSIONAL EDUCATION, NOR DO THEY HAVE A FULLY SET-UP INHERITED NURSING HOME/CLINIC, WHERE THEY WORK FREELY!

    WITH URBAN AREAS GETTING SATURATED WITH DOCTORS, MEDICOS ARE WILLING TO PRACTICE IN DISTANT SUBURBS OF METRO CITIES. I WISH THAT AS OUR COUNTRY NEEDS QUALIFIED DOCTORS, LETS HOPE THAT THE MATTER IS AMICABLY SETTLED BETWEEN MCI & NBE!

    DR.A.J.PAIDHUNGAT.
  44. Guest

    Guest Guest

    i am a dnb medicine guy working at aprivate medical college since last 2 yrs and recently during MCI INSPECTION FOR GETTING RECOGNITION FOR MD MEDICINE AT THIS COLLEGE I WAS DECLARED INELIGIBLE BY ONE OF THE MCI INSPECTOR AS I AM A DNB. I KNOW THE STANDARD OF MD AT THIS COLLEGE I FEEL I AM AT NO POINT LESSER THAN MD PERSON THEN WHY SO MUCH DISCREPANCY? EVEN MCI INSPECTORS ARE NOT AWARE ABOUT THE LETTER/GR ISSUED BY MINISTRY OF HEALTH ISSUED ON 1/06/2006 REG. EQUIVALENCE OF DNB AND MD ITS NOTHING BUT POLITICS AND SPOILING OUR FUTURE . I KNOW ONE OF MY FRIEND WHO JUST CLEARED HIS DNB THEORY PART 2 IN MEDICINE HAD BEEN CONSIDERED FOR RESIDENCY AT USA AND WAS GIVEN 1 YR CREDIT AS HE HAD CLEARED DNB. SO I WONDER IF DNB IS RECOGNISED IN ABROAD BUT NOT IN INDIA.
  45. Q to MD Doc

    Q to MD Doc Guest

    Why the MD Doc does not want to share his name.......is he scared :?: :evil:
  46. DOC123

    DOC123 Guest

    I saw this thread today.I feel it is entirely unfair on MCI to treat people with DNB with stepmotherly attitude.I am a general merit candidate.I have done my masters from one of the premiere institutes then cleared DNB then got my FRCS.Of all these three exams DNB was the toughest and most disorderly exam.It is unfair of MD Doc to show his/her frustration in a discussion forum like this.Many people have taken DNB instead of MD/MS just to be sure they have their chosen speciality.Degrading everyone because someone has found taking DNB an easy way out is ridiculus attitude MD Doc.I really feel ability not a tag of degree should be taken to asses a person.

    Chidanand Kulkarni MS,DNB,FRCS
  47. gom

    gom Guest

    to mr dr md

    so much frustration, u hu sir ..if u cnt respect a degree even if u r doing or u hu done. i really feel very bad for u md .. sir. if u hu ur personal frustation please dnt post it .. with respect sir try to learn the repect first .. i feel u dnt hu respect for ur own degree.. one person is doing md or dnb . u hu full right to say as in this country every one is free to say. but maitain some standrd sir that ur comment doest feel like u r doctor too.... sorry if i hurt ur feeling sir learn some respect
  48. Dr.GOPI

    Dr.GOPI Guest

    ATTENTION ALL DNB TEACHERS IN MEDICAL COLLEGES
    You are all aware that since, 2007 MCI is discouraging DNB Teachers in Medical Colleges on frivolous pretext and recognises them as only Senior Residents, irrespective of their Faculty positions, thus jeopardizing their Self Respect, Honour, Career and Employment opportunities. Thus these highly qualified Medical Teachers (Most expensive Human Resource is being wasted, which our country can ill afford and is a National Crime on the part of MC)are forced to seek Justice in Courts of Law.
    In Karnataka, all such teachers joined to form DNB Alumni Association and filed a writ petition in Honourable High Court of Kanrataka and got an Interim Order to maintain status quo.
    The time has come for all such teachers of this country to come under this banner and fight out the case in Honourable Supreme Court, so that the career and other opportunities of DNB Doctors are protected.
    We, the DNB Faculty, the DNB Qualified, the DNB Institutes and Our Supporters must come together and form a Formidable force to take on mighty MCI. We must ensure widespread publicity to this 'Injustice by MCI' in Electronic & Print Media and in Parliament.
    Please, contact urgently the office bearers of DNB Alumni Association with Valuable Suggestions and become members to add to the Strength and Might of the Association:
    Dr.VIKRAM SHETTY ph: Mobile-09448361244
    Dr.VIJAYALAKSHMI ph: Mobile-09886273009
    Please, continue expressing in this matter.
  49. Hello Dr.Gopi,

    I fully agree with you!

    As ordered by MOHFW in 2006, DNB should be treated on par with MD/MS & government colleges must be allowed to take DNB students in addition to MD/MS if they have sufficient teachers+facilities!

    Our country needs more no. of qualified doctors, in view of it's rather vast population so in the interest of doctors & patients, it will be nice if NBE & MCI sort out the matter immediately & amicably.

    Anyway, if there's a signature campaign, I'm willing to sign the petition.

    Dr.Asha J.Paidhungat.
  50. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Dear all,
    National Board has sent the following restrainer order to many institutes;which ideally should be honoured by MCI officials. Try your luck!!
    Dr.Anjali Bangalore

    From: National Board of Examinations
    Date: 7/5/2008 1:59:46 PM
    To: Bangalore
    Subject: Re: DNB equivalence



    Subject: Non Approval for Appointment to teaching posts for DNB Degree

    Reference: MCI Letter dated 14th September 2007

    Sir/Madam,

    This has reference to the issue of equivalence of DNB qualification with the corresponding MD/MS degree and the above stated letter issued by Medical Council of India. Without prejudice, the regulatory position in respect of the same is as follows:-





    (1) Diplomate of National Board is a recognized qualification as per the Indian Medical Council Act, 1956. DNB qualification is included in the first schedule of the Indian Medical Council Act, 1956.

    (2) The Government of India in its various notifications issued from time to time has upheld the status of DNB as that of equivalent qualification as MD/MS/DM/MCh. The Government of India vide latest notification dated 1st June, 2006 has upheld that holders of DNB qualification are to be treated at par with MD/MS/DM/MCh candidates even to teaching posts such as Assistant Professor or recruitment as Senior Resident. The copy of notification issued by the Government of India is enclosed along with for your kind reference.

    (3) The equivalence of the DNB qualification vis-à-vis the corresponding MD/MD qualification has been upheld by the Hon’ble Supreme Court of India in the matter Kidwai Memorial Institute of Oncology & ors Vs State of Karnataka & Ors.

    One letter dated 14th September, 2007 has been issued by Medical Council of India, on the basis of which your University has issued the above stated captioned letter. The Medical Council of India letter dated 14th September, 2007 has been challenged by various DNB candidates before the Hon’ble Court of Bombay, Nagpur Bench and the Hon’ble Court has been pleased to grant interim relief till final adjudication in the matter takes place. The Hon’ble High Court at Bangalore has also granted interim relief in the matter.


    (5) The Government of India has submitted its detailed reply before the Hon’ble Court and the salient points in the Government of India Affidavit is stated herein below:-

    "The bare perusal of the Indian Medical Council Act 1956 demonstrates that Medical Council of India has been assigned purely recommendatory role for the Under Graduate Medical Education. The provision of the Indian Medical Council Act 1956 clearly lay down that the recommendations of Medical Council of India have to be considered by the Central Government and which alone has to take a decision one way or the other. It is submitted that AIIMS and PGI of Medical Sciences and all such other institutions established under the Act of Parliament are outside the ambit of MCI Act but are under the administrative control of Government of India. The Central Government for reasons well defined in law has all prerogative to take decisions different from the recommendations of MCI.

    That the Hon’ble Supreme Court AIR 1988 SC 1048, Govt. of AP Vs Dr. R. Murli, while considering the effect and implication of the Regulations framed by the MCI, on the basis of the affidavit of the MCI that it is only a recommendatory body and the Regulations framed by it are only recommendatory and not mandatory.

    It is submitted that the DNB degree/qualification is equivalent in all respect with MD/MS degrees and the letter dated 1st June, 2006 has been issued after considering all the factors by the Government of India. In order to bring parity between MD/MS students and DNB qualification holders, it is submitted that the teaching experience gained in institutions conducting DNB courses should be treated as teaching experience for the purpose of appointment as medical teachers in medical colleges/institutions"

    (6) As per the provisions of the Indian Medical Council Act, the role of Medical Council of India is recommendatory to the Government of India. The Medical Council of India cannot encroach upon the powers of Government of India by issuing a letter which even otherwise, is based upon incorrect observations and is a matter of adjudication before various High Courts in the country,


    (7) Considering the stay granted by the Hon’ble Court in the matter and the emerging legal position and till such time, the matter is adjudicated by the Hon’ble court, it is desirable for all recruiting agencies that the status quo may kindly be maintained and the DNB degree holders should not be discriminated, demoted or their assignments/employment terminated.

    Yours sincerely,



    (Dr. A.K. Sood)
    Executive Director

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